This may not be the best way to win back your fan base and create new fans.
Let’s face it–“Heroes” is having a down year. Despite being NBC’s highest rated scripted drama, the third-year series is in trouble. It’s been hemorrhaging viewers since the season premiere, it fired two producers earlier this month and it seems to be falling into the same traps that plagued its heavily criticized second season. And now, speaking to as part of the “Heroes” panel at the Creative Screenwriting’s 2008 Screenwriting Expo, executive producer and series creator Tim Kring has opened his mouth and firmly inserted his foot.
The panel may have been in trouble before it started. It was initially supposed to be Kring and producers Jeff Loeb and Jesse Alexander. But then Loeb and Alexander were given pink slips by the show and NBC, leading to some confusion as to who would be a part of the panel. At first it was all three, then Loeb and Alexander and finally it was Kring flying solo.
As part of the panel, Kring said that his initial desire was to create an serialized ensemble drama along the lines of “24” or “Lost” for NBC.  The Peacock network didn’t have such a series and Kring thought that “Heroes” would be a perfect fit for the network.
Now, three years in, it appears Kring isn’t quite as sure the idea was so hot.
According to a report on IGN, he joked that quickly he wondered, “What was I thinking?” noting that a serialized show is “an absolute bear to do.”
Kring said he’s also finding, “It’s a very flawed way of telling stories on network television right now, because of the advent of the DVR and online streaming. The engine that drove [serialized TV] was you had to be in front of the TV [when it aired]. Now you can watch it when you want, where you want, how you want to watch it, and almost all of those ways are superior to watching it on air. So [watching it] on air is related to the saps and the dips**s who can’t figure out how to watch it in a superior way.”
Kring went on to say that he has no definite idea how the series could or will end, saying it has “no island to get off of.” He also said that his original vision for the series was to have the main cast be ever changing.
“My original idea was more of an anthological vibe to it, where you regenerate the characters,” he said. “The problem is you run into a whole series of issues, where show and business run into each other. The network falls in love with characters, the audience falls in love with characters, the press falls in love with characters. And it’s contractually hard to get people onboard for a brief period. You find yourself writing for characters you thought would be gone.”
Kring also says he doesn’t really respond to audience demands based on specific episodes because of the lead time required in producing the show.
“It’s never directly, because we’re so far ahead of them,” he said. “We were shooting episode 13 [the final chapter of the current volume, “Villains”] when we launched [Season 3]. Any feedback by the audience is irrelevant in terms of that. But bigger trends you want to follow.”
Of course, Kring’s calling his audiences “dips***s” has set off a firestorm of reaction across the Internet.
Time Magazine‘s James Poniewozik responded, saying:
First, the requirement of watching live was, in fact, the greatest impediment to serials in the past. If you missed an episode and couldn’t catch a rerun, you were off the train, and it was that much harder to get back on. If you can watch on Hulu, or a second run on cable, or a replay on your DVR, it’s easier to catch up. Anecdotally, I know a lot of people who will only watch serial shows on DVR or DVD, so they can watch several episodes at a stretch. Take Lost: it may never draw CSI numbers, but it does well enough to be well worth ABC’s investment, precisely because of an intense fan base, many of whom DVR it to rewind and catch details—and its huge sales on DVD are not exactly a liability to anyone concerned.
Look, I’ll grant Kring that pulling off a hit serial is hard: when they hit big, it’s a jackpot, but they often fail big too. (It was also hard when Heroes was a hit, all of two years ago.) And who knows: I have a hard time imagining Heroes succeeding as anything other than what it is, but if he can revive it as some kind of Justice League anthology, more power to him. But it does no one any favors to rationalize its problems as the fault of technologies that have mostly benefitted media consumers, or a storytelling format that has produced the best television of the past decade.
Whatever problems Heroes has, the fault lies not in its DVRs but in itself.
And the Chicago Tribune’s Maureen O’Brien responded:
How absolutely infuriating. How does Kring muster the gall to insult anyone who’s still watching his show? What arrogance. What cluelessness. Not only is his argument weak and without merit, he stoops to calling “Heroes” viewers names.
The only sap here is Kring. Any and all insulting terms should be directed at himself. After all, who is responsible for two seasons of mostly muddy, incoherent storytelling? It wasn’t the saps at home on their couches.
We will have to wait and see if Kring’s comments create any “backlash” among fans. Monday’s ratings could be very interesting.
GazerBeam says
You know, there’s so much good on Monday nights, that this might just have to become a backseat, now. I’ve been plodding through the huge mess of character retcons, plot contrivances and stories to nowhere because I had faith in the creators. If they don’t have faith themselves, why should I?
Lejon from Chandler says
Well, I suppose I could stop doing my NaNoWriMo project and sit like a zombie in front of the TV Monday nights, but I find that I would have to go in search of brains and that would make me leave the room….I guess I’m just a d!p$#!7.
Jeff says
I don’t see the problem everyone is having. I love the show. But Kring is a douchebag for calling the viewers names
Indiana Jim says
So glad I never got on the stupid train to begin with….
Michael L says
I can’t even watch this mess any more. I used to love this show, but can”t figure out what is going on with everyone this year.
M.Talon says
I’m not getting the same vibe off of his remarks as everyone else seems to be. I don’t think he was trying to slam the fans. He knows the majority of the people who watch genre shows are smart and intelligent. He also knows that they tend to watch shows via the internet or DVR.
His frustration seems more to be the fact that the studios still look at “normal” TV viewing as the benchmark, and shows like Heroes and Lost don’t fit that benchmark well. It’s almost impossible to get people to sit down and watch a serial show if they haven’t caught up. If they have caught up, they do it online (and thus fall into the non “sap” crowd). From that point of view, trying to keep a serial show going for the non-techies is near impossible. You have to cater to a crowd that isn’t your core fans, and those are the ones who complain because a show isn’t brain dead boring like your average sitcom.
He could have chosen his words better, but I think his frustration is valid. Until the gauge of a show’s success moves away from the traditional “bottom in seat at 8pm” metric, shows like Heroes will continue to be considered failures. I wonder what ratings would look like if the industry actually seriously considered DVR recording/watching and online hits.
GazerBeam says
The problem with considering DVR in the ratings is the whole reason behind them. The rating system is used by the network to sell advertising time (which is what actually funds the show). So if they could find a way for you to not skip the commercials, then they’ll count the DVR numbers.
Network TV here in the states is almost totally ad-supported. If the companies don’t think you’re watching the ads, they won’t buy the time to air the commercials.
Personally, I’d like the whole thing switch to Internet-based video on demand. Since the whole of TV is going digital in February, why not take the model they have on the website (full episode with one or two commercials you can’t skip in each break), and stream them directly through the cable companies to the TV.
This rambled a bit more than I wanted…
Dave says
I’m not going to apologize for an awesome series. I’m confused if I’m watching the same show as everyone else. It’s been a little slow at times, granted, but I’m in it for the long-haul, and honestly, the Sylar storyline is still awesome.
Screw off if you don’t like the show. Or watch it and complain if that brings you enjoyment.
tlsmith1963 says
I’ve never been able to really get into Heroes. I wanted something that was more like Superhero movies, but I never got it.
Ringsting says
Apart from lost, bsg, and sometimes 24 there isn’t anything that comes anywhere near heroes in terms of quality. I couldn’t bear the thought of watching someone solve another murder case in a slightly different way to last week with no story telling needed.
Kring was right, people who are still watching the shows in the old fashioned ways are dipsticks and in turn holding back the change in the way we are watching TV. The sooner broadcast TV dies the better.
Indiana Jim says
Pardon me whilst I screw off….
D. C. says
Well, Kring did step in it. Everyone’s had that moment where as soon as the words left their lips they’d wanted to pull them back.
I still am enjoying the show. It’s not as good as season one and I do think they need to shed some of characters like Mohindar and maybe Peter, unless they can figure out how to use him without making him too powerful.
The big mistake they’re making is the same one they made in Season two: They’re keeping Hiro and Ando too isolated from the rest of the cast. He’s a teleporter. There’s no reason why Hiro can’t live in Japan and still interact with the rest of the cast.
mister_d says
Have to defend Kring (kinda, sorta.) The quote is being misinterpreted (by mostly everyone) as an attack on DVR/Online/DVD viewers and/or fans of the show – It’s not.
He is saying that as the fans of Heroes and other serialized shows move to viewing schedules better suited to serial viewing (when it’s convenient and/or in larger chunks), the only potential live audience left (who he refers to as “saps and dips***s” – a bit harsh) isn’t going to want to watch a serial. His point is that the way things are still expected to work from the Networks perspectives, is that live is the bread and butter.
Kring is just a guy backed into a corner, who managed tripped himself up with a poorly worded comment. Cut him some slack.
Selganor says
It might just be because english is my second language and I read the whole statement before starting to get angry at Tim Kring (and then NOT getting angry), but here’s how I read his statement:
“It’s a very flawed way of telling stories on network television right now, because of the advent of the DVR and online streaming. ”
Telling stories on network television is a very flawed way, because of DVR and online streaming.
“The engine that drove [serialized TV] was you had to be in front of the TV [when it aired]. Now you can watch it when you want, where you want, how you want to watch it, and almost all of those ways are superior to watching it on air. ”
Serialized TV was driven by viewers being in front of the TV when it aired. DVR/streaming/… are superior to watching tv on air.
“So [watching it] on air is related to the saps and the dips**s who can’t figure out how to watch it in a superior way.â€
Here’s where the “saps and the dips**s” (who DON’T use DVRs or streaming) and are watching Heroes on tv when it airs MIGHT get angry with Tim Kring, but since the people in the studio who got outraged about this statement all used alternate methods, THEY wouldn’t have been angry about this statement. (At least not for their own sakes)
So, if you want to defend the people who still watch it on tv when it runs, why don’t you show those people how they may get “better”?
Buzz Ryan says
You know… if you make a product that doesn’t appeal to you customer base then calling them dipshits isn’t going to improve your production. That’s like the Big 3 telling me I am a jackhole or not buying a big gas guzzling SUV and thus bringing on there financial woes.
Shame on Kring.
gwen aka tllgrrl says
Like M.Talon said.
Me? I’m not having a problem with Heroes. I don’t understand why the bitching.
Kring has a point. Then again, I never had a problem with what Russell T Davies said about fans, either.